Ultimate space simulation software

 
alfa015
Space Tourist
Space Tourist
Topic Author
Posts: 29
Joined: 26 Jul 2017

What exoplanet might reply us back?

06 Jul 2018 15:01

So.. we have sent radio messages to Gliese 273 b and the Gliese 581 system, where planet 'g' hasn't been confirmed yet but it is potentially habitable. 

Which of these exoplanets, if any, do you think might reply us back? 

Put in other words, which of these exoplanets do you think it might have intelligent life? 

I recently made a video about this topic, just in case someone wants to check it out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egEcoNB5pZU&list=PL3RiFKfZj3pv9tm2gNUx313_nrZtX4W8M
 
User avatar
midtskogen
World Builder
World Builder
Posts: 643
Joined: 11 Dec 2016
Location: Oslo, Norway
Contact:

What exoplanet might reply us back?

06 Jul 2018 15:46

I think life is rare and intelligent life extremely rare. But most of all I think we have little data to say much about it. That might change with mass surveys of exoplanet atmospheres, which should be doable within decades.

Even in our own benign solar system, which has life, the evidence so far points to a single world only with life.
NIL DIFFICILE VOLENTI
 
User avatar
Watsisname
Science Officer
Science Officer
Posts: 1307
Joined: 06 Sep 2016
Location: Bellingham, WA

What exoplanet might reply us back?

07 Jul 2018 00:18

I would also not have high hopes of getting a reply from them, even if we knew somehow that there was intelligent life there.
 
User avatar
midtskogen
World Builder
World Builder
Posts: 643
Joined: 11 Dec 2016
Location: Oslo, Norway
Contact:

What exoplanet might reply us back?

07 Jul 2018 02:39

Something I don't get is this idea to send music.  Even if some intelligent life is able to detect it and play it, it could mean nothing to them, except being an indication that it is not a natural signal.  Musical rhythm mimics our heartbeat, melody our speech, and aliens may have a very different heartbeat or a totally different circulatory system altogether, and, if communicating with sound at all, their speech may sound nothing like ours.
NIL DIFFICILE VOLENTI
 
User avatar
Gnargenox
Pioneer
Pioneer
Posts: 590
Joined: 11 Dec 2016
Location: 179° 56′ 39.4″ +0° 2′ 46.2″ @ 7,940 ± 420 pc

What exoplanet might reply us back?

07 Jul 2018 08:48

Humanity has only been producing radio signals over the past 50 years or so, let's just say, at extremely low power levels too. There are only about 500 G type Stars within 50 light years of us, and only about 5% of those have been seen to have planets. There could be 14,000 or fewer Red Dwarfs within that distance, but I think there's too many radiation issues with those type stars for any biological or complex chemical processes to work long term. I think there are about 4 white dwarfs nearby. So that gives us about only 2 or 3 other stars to take a peek at. If you were going to double the distance you would get about A dozen stars to look at for life. If I was a betting man I would bet every single dollar on Earth and all the chocolate Humanity has ever produced that we are alone within our own Galaxy, at the very least. So, no, we will never have a conversation with anyone unless they can break the laws of physics and travel to us.
CPU: AMD FX-8350 8 core processor 4GHz / GPU: GeForce GT 730 @ 1920x1080, 60Hz with 1GB adapter RAM / RAM: Patriot Signature 4GB 1600MHz 240-Pin DDR3 (only 2GB work, don't buy it) / Motherboard: MSI 970 Gaming MS-7693
 
User avatar
midtskogen
World Builder
World Builder
Posts: 643
Joined: 11 Dec 2016
Location: Oslo, Norway
Contact:

What exoplanet might reply us back?

07 Jul 2018 10:35

Radio stations for the public have been operating for about a century, but as you say, the power is weak, hardly more than 50 kW.  At stellar distances these radio leaks are likely too faint to be detected practically.
NIL DIFFICILE VOLENTI
 
User avatar
Propulsion Disk
Explorer
Explorer
Posts: 162
Joined: 04 Jun 2018
Location: In My lab at the moment.

What exoplanet might reply us back?

08 Jul 2018 08:32

midtskogen wrote:
Radio stations for the public have been operating for about a century, but as you say, the power is weak, hardly more than 50 kW.  At stellar distances these radio leaks are likely too faint to be detected practically.

If any extraterrestrials know how to pick up radio signals. ;)
I'm good when it comes to Physics, Algebra, Relativity, Space, and SpaceEngine. But I could still use a LOT of help on the things I still don't know. So I hope I get a lot of help on how all that works, here!
 
User avatar
JackDole
World Builder
World Builder
Posts: 1014
Joined: 02 Nov 2016
Location: Terra

What exoplanet might reply us back?

08 Jul 2018 10:19

Advanced civilizations are probably beyond radio. They are probably using hyper-radio. Or they use the quantum tunneling effect to transmit messages.
 
alfa015
Space Tourist
Space Tourist
Topic Author
Posts: 29
Joined: 26 Jul 2017

What exoplanet might reply us back?

08 Jul 2018 11:34

thanks for your answers !
 
User avatar
Palauan
Space Pilot
Space Pilot
Posts: 115
Joined: 13 May 2018

What exoplanet might reply us back?

08 Jul 2018 12:31

I think in about 10-20 years someone will reply back.
 
User avatar
FastFourierTransform
Explorer
Explorer
Posts: 221
Joined: 17 Nov 2016

What exoplanet might reply us back?

08 Jul 2018 15:00

Palauan wrote:
Source of the post I think in about 10-20 years someone will reply back.

Look at this table. The closest arrival date for a targeted interstellar message is the Morimoto - Hirabayashi Message, which arrived to its destination, Altair, in 2017. Altair is located just 16.7 light years away.
So a response could arrive from Altair at best in the year 2034 (16 years from now). That is if we assume there is life there which is very improbable considering what we commented hereabout O, B and A type stars habitability (Altair is an A-type). We have also to assume that life is intelligent there, which is also highly unlikely in particular for this system if we consider that Altair is only 1.2 billion years old (no time for any kind of conceivable evolutionary track to intelligence in my opinion). Also we have to assume that they want to answer to us. And even in that case the response would arrive in 2034 if and only if they inmediatly responded (do you think we will respond in less than a year if this ever happenes to us? with all the political, diplomatic and military issues humanity would have to debate to make sure there is consensus in the content of the message).
So I would say that this is just having faith.

So what's the next chance we have? Well, the RuBisCo Stars project sent a radio message to Teegarden's star (which is just 12.6 light years away from us) in November 2009 so an inmediate response would be received here around 2035 (a year after Altair's response). 2035 is in 17 years. That's good. I think this is a better candidate because the star is an M-type star, although we haven't detected any planet yet in that system (besides huge efforts).

RuBisCos stars project also aimed to L1159-16, low mass star some 14 light years away. An inmediate response would arrive to Earth in the year 2038 at least (20 years from now). But is a bad candidate considering the fact that L1159-16 is a flare star. X-ray activity and violent variability is a very likely inhibitor for life generation. I wouldn't bet for this star.

All these targets yield a response in less than 2038 in the best case scenario. But we have still not detected a single planet in the three cases. And they are not very promising as habitable systems. Even if they were promising systems for habitability the possibility that they have life, life is intelligent in nature, they are willing to answer and they answer inmediately is just puny. Even then, if all of that is acomplished, you still have to think that receiving an aswer from one of this would basically mean that there are intelligent species all around and close to home. It is very very unlikely that we find intelligent life just in the first star we try to message. Absurdly unlikely in my opinion.

The next possible response will come from Gliese 581 in 2050 (always considering the best case scenario). And next responses are for the next century in the best case scenario still.

So hoping for a reply from an extraterrestrial intelligence in the next 10-20 is been the most optimistic the math allows you to be. In my opinion the only hope is to get a signal, but not as a reply but as an actual first message from a civilization a thousand years ago from another part of the solar neighbourhood. Even then I consider optimistic the idea of another civilization in our entire galaxy so maybe we will never get an actual answer at all.
 
firewyre
Observer
Observer
Posts: 4
Joined: 05 Jul 2018

What exoplanet might reply us back?

09 Jul 2018 17:56

[quote="alfa015"]So.. we have sent radio messages to Gliese 273 b and the Gliese 581 system, where planet 'g' hasn't been confirmed yet but it is potentially habitable. 

Which of these exoplanets, if any, do you think might reply us back?[/quote]

I think we're out of luck on both of these. I've pretty much written off and chance of intelligent life on tidally locked planets around red dwarfs. These have orbital periods of about 18 and 37 days respectively and are relatively close in to their turbulent little stars, so they are likely tidally locked and riddled with radiation :(
 
User avatar
Stellarator
Explorer
Explorer
Posts: 182
Joined: 10 Jul 2018
Location: Andromeda A* blackhole

What exoplanet might reply us back?

12 Jul 2018 07:56

Looking at all the data available on the exoplanets we know of, its unlikely ANY of them have life. Most are just too large, too hot, too cold and thus too strange to have anything more then a extremophile ecology. That is just their detection method bias. Life (beyond microbes) and intelligent life can probably evolve in conditions other then those of Earth, but it will be rare, just like Earth analogs. Kepler and other exoplanetary-seeking missions simply did not sample enough of the stars in our galaxy to come across a solar system with life in it - although their samples come in the form of thousands of stars. 
Futurum Fusionem
 
User avatar
Watsisname
Science Officer
Science Officer
Posts: 1307
Joined: 06 Sep 2016
Location: Bellingham, WA

What exoplanet might reply us back?

12 Jul 2018 17:49

Some of the planets in the Kepler or other exoplanet catalogs could have life on them.  We know there are several that at least are similar to Earth in size, mass, and solar insolation.  Beyond that we simply don't know.  They could be barren, more similar to Mars or Venus.  Once we're able to get good data on exoplanet atmospheres, we will be able to understand much more about them in terms of potential habitability, and how common (or uncommon) life might be.
 
User avatar
midtskogen
World Builder
World Builder
Posts: 643
Joined: 11 Dec 2016
Location: Oslo, Norway
Contact:

What exoplanet might reply us back?

13 Jul 2018 02:39

But it's important to understand that by "could have life" what is meant by "could" is as in the statement "Venus or Mars could have life".  And the odds that Venus or Mars have life are low, certainly for anything as complex as cellular life or more complex.

IF it turns out that Venus or Mars indeed have life (I think both are dead and always have been, but we can't be sure), it will be a kind of life which will be extremely hard to detect on exoplanets, since we haven't yet been able to detect it even having sent numerous probes to these planets).
NIL DIFFICILE VOLENTI

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest